Author Topic: Well Honda has gotten serious about off-road once again.  (Read 2575 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Trail Ryder

  • HHM
  • All pro
  • *
  • Posts: 2675
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Well Honda has gotten serious about off-road once again.
« Reply #15 on: October 19, 2017, 03:43:59 pm »
Well Honda has gotten serious about off-road once again.  New CRF250L is a serious dual sporter:

http://powersports.honda.com/Model/dual%20sport/2017/crf250l.aspx

Liquid Cooled, EFI, Six speed tranny, 18" rear, for a base price of $5149

 ABS and a rally model are options.

Jim.

At $5,349 and 14 lbs ligher (304 lbs wet), this may be a better option:

https://www.dirtrider.com/2018-kawasaki-klx250-first-ride-review?cmpid=enews101917&spMailingID=31091570&spUserID=NjMxMTY4MDQ0ODMS1&spJobID=1142468289&spReportId=MTE0MjQ2ODI4OQS2#page-5

Quote
and we can say it has much more get-up-and-go than a Honda CRF250L.

Kawasaki did miss the boat though by not just making it 300cc from the get go (with parts they already have in stock).

2018 KTM XCW 250 (carbed) - NY Street Plated

"Lol'd at the guy that didn't hook up his tether and launched his retard chariot into the crowd."
- redrider911
"Yup you had crappy gay stuff compared to what is available now ..."
- bardeenm1

bardeenm1

  • Senior Member
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 94
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Well Honda has gotten serious about off-road once again.
« Reply #16 on: October 20, 2017, 11:25:11 am »
I'll be honest these bikes are of interest to me.  I am less interested these days of trying to smash myself on tight single track or air out a big jump on an MX track.  Racing is not what I am looking for and while hard core hero and enduro sections are cool i'm not sure that is what I am looking to do now days either.

Riding some logging roads, atv trails and some flowing trails is what is of interest to me.  I know I might be a pussy for not wanting try the hardest trails or hit the MX track but that is where I am at in my life.  About a year now with no full sized bike in my garage I need to figure out a direction or get a SXS! :o



Trail Ryder

  • HHM
  • All pro
  • *
  • Posts: 2675
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Well Honda has gotten serious about off-road once again.
« Reply #17 on: October 20, 2017, 12:15:10 pm »
I'll be honest these bikes are of interest to me.  I am less interested these days of trying to smash myself on tight single track or air out a big jump on an MX track.  Racing is not what I am looking for and while hard core hero and enduro sections are cool i'm not sure that is what I am looking to do now days either.

Riding some logging roads, atv trails and some flowing trails is what is of interest to me.  I know I might be a pussy for not wanting try the hardest trails or hit the MX track but that is where I am at in my life.  About a year now with no full sized bike in my garage I need to figure out a direction or get a SXS! :o

I used to be on one of these types of bikes and will probably move back into one of these and / or an adventure bike when I pass age 60 or so.

However, I moved away from a Japanese dual sport as there just weren't many places to ride with "easy" trails and there were a lot of riding opportunities with single track, where the heavy Jap bikes would just wear me out.

SXS are expensive and the riding opportunies for them are bleak in our region.
2018 KTM XCW 250 (carbed) - NY Street Plated

"Lol'd at the guy that didn't hook up his tether and launched his retard chariot into the crowd."
- redrider911
"Yup you had crappy gay stuff compared to what is available now ..."
- bardeenm1

Jim Dettman

  • Senior Member
  • All pro
  • *
  • Posts: 1137
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Well Honda has gotten serious about off-road once again.
« Reply #18 on: October 20, 2017, 08:07:10 pm »
Looks like the ante got upped👍

MFGís are smart to be coming out with bikes like these.   With restrictions growing on riding areas,  dual sport is only going to become more popular.

And yeah,  they should have made it a 300cc.   That seems like the sweet spot for most.  250ís just fall a tad short, especially for a dual sport.

Jim
2009 CRF250x /2009 CRF450x

Trail Ryder

  • HHM
  • All pro
  • *
  • Posts: 2675
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Well Honda has gotten serious about off-road once again.
« Reply #19 on: October 21, 2017, 04:41:27 pm »
Yeah, make a 300, with existing parts they already have, and they will lure many DRZ buyers.
2018 KTM XCW 250 (carbed) - NY Street Plated

"Lol'd at the guy that didn't hook up his tether and launched his retard chariot into the crowd."
- redrider911
"Yup you had crappy gay stuff compared to what is available now ..."
- bardeenm1

Trail Ryder

  • HHM
  • All pro
  • *
  • Posts: 2675
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Well Honda has gotten serious about off-road once again.
« Reply #20 on: May 24, 2018, 09:36:01 am »
OK, so it looks like Honda is getting more serious and responding up to KTM's dominance of the off-road and dual sport market by offering with the 2019 CRF250RX and street-legal 2019 CRF450L:

https://powersports.honda.com/2019/crf250rx.aspx

https://powersports.honda.com/2019/crf450l.aspx

Granted, Honda did introduce the 2018 CRF450RX but a 450 is way too much power for most East Coast riders.

I am glad that Honda and Yamaha have gotten more and more involved again the off-road and dual sport market.  Hopefully, this added competition and pressure will force KTM to stop being so cocky with their pricing.

But, I am still sort of missing the mid to late 90's when Suzuki dominated off-road racing and the dual sport market.

Anywho, here is an early 3rd party review:

http://www.advpulse.com/adv-bikes/2019-honda-crf450l-announced/

Quote
Understanding Hondaís strict durability standards for street-legal machines, we have little doubt that a properly-maintained CRF450L would handle the rigors of long-sustained travel. So far on paper, the only thing that might put a damper on riding this machine is a curb weight that tips the scales a bit heavy for the class. At a claimed 289 pounds wet (the new CRF450X is 275 pounds), the CRF450L is about 34 pounds heavier than a KTM 500 EXC-F. Also, depending on your budget, the target price of $10,399 might be a little steep but it is still about $600 cheaper than the Austrian 500s of the same style.

At 30 lbs heavier, though they will definitely need to be more most cost competitive (than $600 cheaper) to dethrone KTM.

« Last Edit: May 24, 2018, 11:52:59 am by Trail Ryder »
2018 KTM XCW 250 (carbed) - NY Street Plated

"Lol'd at the guy that didn't hook up his tether and launched his retard chariot into the crowd."
- redrider911
"Yup you had crappy gay stuff compared to what is available now ..."
- bardeenm1

Trail Ryder

  • HHM
  • All pro
  • *
  • Posts: 2675
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Well Honda has gotten serious about off-road once again.
« Reply #21 on: May 28, 2018, 11:17:18 pm »
https://dirtbikemagazine.com/inside-hondas-new-crf450l-dual-sport-bike-the-wrap/?utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Dirt%20Bike%20News%205-26&utm_content=Dirt%20Bike%20News%205-26+CID_2e2219304f2470db5b8458ba8b6198d5&utm_source=create%20send&utm_term=UP%20CLOSE%20WITH%20THE%20HONDA%20CRF450L

Quote
The bikeís weight was a topic of concern. Itís listed at 289 pounds. Thatís shocking when you compare it to the Husky FE501 (248 pounds without fuel on our scale) and the Beta 500RR (257 pounds). But you need to take several factors into consideration.

Look Mom, no kick start:

2018 KTM XCW 250 (carbed) - NY Street Plated

"Lol'd at the guy that didn't hook up his tether and launched his retard chariot into the crowd."
- redrider911
"Yup you had crappy gay stuff compared to what is available now ..."
- bardeenm1

ajd187

  • Administrator
  • All pro
  • *****
  • Posts: 9067
    • View Profile
Re: Well Honda has gotten serious about off-road once again.
« Reply #22 on: May 29, 2018, 08:00:35 am »
They list the weight with a full tank of fuel.  It holds a whole two gallons (really?  come on two gallons?) so that's 13 lbs right off the top and I'm sure KTM is listing theirs with empty tanks.

No kickstart...meh.  Lots of manufacturers are dumping that.  Roll it down a hill if the battery dies :)
2007 KTM 200 XC-W #59

Trail Ryder

  • HHM
  • All pro
  • *
  • Posts: 2675
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Well Honda has gotten serious about off-road once again.
« Reply #23 on: May 29, 2018, 12:07:25 pm »
They list the weight with a full tank of fuel.  It holds a whole two gallons (really?  come on two gallons?) so that's 13 lbs right off the top and I'm sure KTM is listing theirs with empty tanks.

For the 2018 KTM 500 EXC, KTM claims 240 lbs dry (which has been verified by the industry); add in 15 lbs for fuel, coolant, and oil puts you 255 lbs wet .... 34 lbs less than the "new" 2019 CRF450L.

Yes, you can strip weight off of the Honda but you can do the same with the KTM.

FWIW, the off-road only 2019 Honda CRF450X is 275 lbs wet and also does not offer a kick start.

No kickstart...meh.  Lots of manufacturers are dumping that.  Roll it down a hill if the battery dies :)

Unless you are at the bottom of a hill or gully ... or if you have a Rekluse auto clutch.  Then you are SOL.

Granted, I am glad that Honda is FINALLY getting serious about the dual sport trail riding market.  But to not offer any way to add a kick starter and show up 34 lbs heavier than the 3 year-old bike that is 50cc larger is not going to get any customers to jump ship.
2018 KTM XCW 250 (carbed) - NY Street Plated

"Lol'd at the guy that didn't hook up his tether and launched his retard chariot into the crowd."
- redrider911
"Yup you had crappy gay stuff compared to what is available now ..."
- bardeenm1

Trail Ryder

  • HHM
  • All pro
  • *
  • Posts: 2675
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Well Honda has gotten serious about off-road once again.
« Reply #24 on: July 16, 2018, 08:14:00 pm »
All that stuff in there looks HEAVY:

2018 KTM XCW 250 (carbed) - NY Street Plated

"Lol'd at the guy that didn't hook up his tether and launched his retard chariot into the crowd."
- redrider911
"Yup you had crappy gay stuff compared to what is available now ..."
- bardeenm1

Trail Ryder

  • HHM
  • All pro
  • *
  • Posts: 2675
    • View Profile
    • Email
2018 KTM XCW 250 (carbed) - NY Street Plated

"Lol'd at the guy that didn't hook up his tether and launched his retard chariot into the crowd."
- redrider911
"Yup you had crappy gay stuff compared to what is available now ..."
- bardeenm1

redrider911

  • Global Moderator
  • All pro
  • *****
  • Posts: 5650
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Well Honda has gotten serious about off-road once again.
« Reply #26 on: September 19, 2018, 07:59:54 am »
Game changer for Honda lmao. They need to fire their entire r&d dept
"I swear, some chicks around here look like they fell face first into a tackle box on their way to or from the IHOP."
- Trail Ryder

ajd187

  • Administrator
  • All pro
  • *****
  • Posts: 9067
    • View Profile
Re: Well Honda has gotten serious about off-road once again.
« Reply #27 on: September 19, 2018, 10:19:22 am »
It's great for Honda.  HAHAHA. 

You can thank Kalifornia for all this shit.  Charcoal canister, air injection, catalytic convertor.  LOL.  Garbage.
2007 KTM 200 XC-W #59

Trail Ryder

  • HHM
  • All pro
  • *
  • Posts: 2675
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Well Honda has gotten serious about off-road once again.
« Reply #28 on: September 19, 2018, 12:52:13 pm »
Game changer for Honda lmao. They need to fire their entire r&d dept

It's not their R&D, it is their corporate leadership that is too conservative to push the limits on dual sport street legality or even offer a 2-stroke.  But it makes you wonder how KTM and Husqvarna can get by with plastic tanks, whereas Honda needs a heavy and expensive metal unit .... and a muffler off of Brodozer.

At least it is a step in the right direction for Honda ... but it needs to lose another 40 lbs of heft to make consumers jump ship back to Honda.
2018 KTM XCW 250 (carbed) - NY Street Plated

"Lol'd at the guy that didn't hook up his tether and launched his retard chariot into the crowd."
- redrider911
"Yup you had crappy gay stuff compared to what is available now ..."
- bardeenm1

Trail Ryder

  • HHM
  • All pro
  • *
  • Posts: 2675
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Well Honda has gotten serious about off-road once again.
« Reply #29 on: September 27, 2018, 04:42:22 pm »
Dirt Rider's Review:  https://www.dirtrider.com/hondas-2019-crf450l-exceeds-expectations?CMPID=ene092718#page-8

Quote
When Honda released first details of the 2019 CRF450L, Honda fans rejoiced as KTM, Beta, and Husqvarna grit their teeth, knowing very well the European domination of the hard-core dual-sport segment is in jeopardy. A glance down the spec sheet and all looked great for Honda and worrisome for the big three. Until nearly the last line of the sheetó289-pound curb weight? Insert record scratch here. Fanboys held their heads and detractors high-fived. .....

After 102 miles of mixed trail and some street, itís clear Honda has hit the mark with the 2019 CRF450L. Is it a game changer? For dual-sporting, no, but for Honda, absolutely. Kudos to the entire team at Honda for building a dual-sport to compete with the European offerings but in the Honda way. Itís huge for Honda to create a street-legal bike with a trail-to-trail philosophy. Mikio Uchiyama, Large Project Leader for the CRF, was on hand for the launch and was all smiles as I high-fived him and his team on a job well done. The CRF450L may be chubby, but donít ever try to discount it of because of that one fact. Itís so much more than just a number.
2018 KTM XCW 250 (carbed) - NY Street Plated

"Lol'd at the guy that didn't hook up his tether and launched his retard chariot into the crowd."
- redrider911
"Yup you had crappy gay stuff compared to what is available now ..."
- bardeenm1